Job Hunting: Talking Through the Process

If you find yourself looking for a new position, or considering it, Mike Lunney talks us through the waves and gives some great insight into a good decision-making process. And Mike reminds us to take our fingers off the panic button, it's going to work out!

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Let me ask you something, Mike. When you went into a job, when you went into a job, and I know you you know you're one of the people that did not have a new job every couple of years. And I I don't mean that in negative or to anybody or anything. People do what they do. But did you ever go into a job thinking, you know, or at least after the first couple of weeks, think I might be looking for a job again next year.

SPEAKER_00 0:31

Uh yeah. When when I went to, I'll just say the name. When I went to Wiley, I stayed there for 19 years. But I I swear to you, Derek, if uh if if I did not at the time have a four-year-old son and a wife and had just bought a house, I'd have turned in my keys after summer band and left. That was the most miserable uh summer band I've experienced in my life. And just and it wasn't any one person's fault, it me included as a fault, but uh it just did not go well. But we I didn't have any choice, so I suffered through it and then I stayed 19 years because I guess no one else would hire me. I don't know. I didn't I don't know why I'm doing this podcast today because I know nothing about job hunting because yeah, but yeah, let's say right there's you you get there and then you start thinking, oh man, this is not gonna work. You know, so I I'm just you know, the old I'm not happy here, it goes pretty deep sometimes.

SPEAKER_01 1:34

Well, I typically encourage people to go ahead and wait out the first couple of months because it should get better. Yeah. But if if by chance we've gotten through, you know, most of two semesters and it just feels like it might be time to to to change you could be in there too. Yeah. Right? My question is, what can we do if we're thinking about making a change after we've wrestled with should I? Let's say we're about ready. Is there a best time? Is there a season for it? Is there are we you know, how do you carefully put feelers out? Anything you can share with us uh talking about uh job hunting.

SPEAKER_00 2:26

Yeah, it is that time of year as this podcast comes out. But you know, we we got to realize too that there's so many reasons why people are hunting for jobs. You know, it might be that their significant other got a really nice job in a different city, and it's like, well, you know, they they just got a$20,000 pay raise or whatever, and they've furthered their career now, I've got to look for a job. It might be that you're not satisfied with with what you're not all about me, Mike. No, no, not not at all. No, and it's uh yeah, and it might be a situation of where you're not happy with where you're at, and you you can kind of see the writing on the wall that and there's you know, there's that passive aggressive uh administration thing of, you know, we're we're not gonna up your budget, we're not gonna do this, we're not gonna do this for you. And after a while, you really do get the feeling of, you know, they probably really don't want me here. You know, they just they just don't want to come out and say it yet, you know. And I was always really super honest to the point of it being a fault with my admin. I'd always tell them, said, you know, if you don't want me to be here, just tell me. So there's not going to be a lawsuit. There's not, you don't have to do a growth plan, you don't have to do paperwork. Just call me in the office and say, Mike, you know, we just kind of we just we want to have someone different in your job. And so as lovely as you are. Yeah, I'm pretty thick skinned. Is like, you know, I'd rather have the honesty than the passive aggressive thing that happens. Or it could simply be the fact that they just want, they like what they're doing. And I'll give you a good example. I was at holiday, excuse me, when I went to Wiley, and I was perfectly happy at holiday. I mean, it was a it was a good band. David Akins had won honor band there the year before I got there. So I inherited the state honor band. Um, and I inherited a band that uh my seniors had had a gold medal their eighth grade year and a bronze medal their sophomore year, and they took me to State Marching their senior year, you know, and let me participate in it with them. You know, so I was well, you said that. Yeah, I was extremely happy with with that with that group. But you know, the the Wiley thing opened up and for me personally, it was a it was a bigger school, and I felt like it was the school that best fit my son Austin's uh needs. And I wanted him to go, he hadn't he had not started full-time school yet, you know, he's a four-year-old. Um, so he's about to turn five. So we did the pioneer drive kind of preschool thing. And I'm it was real important to me that he that we try to have him go to the same school for all 12 years. And it worked. It worked. So for me, it was I came to the the realization that I did not get a pay raise, but I felt like it was a better situation for my family, if that makes sense. Right. And sometimes it is a simple pay raise. I mean, money is money, you know. Money walks, and you know what, you know, no, money talks and you know what walks. You know what I mean? So if someone comes to you and says, hey, we'll give you$15,000 to come over here and be our band director, and you'll have an extra band staff member and we're gonna work on the budget. Um, that's hard to just go, no, I'm I'm happy. You know, you've got to look at all these. So get back to your original question, though, because I kind of chased a rabbit there. Um, but you know, it goes in waves, in my opinion. There's wave one. This is, and we've already passed this wave. It's the pre-UIL wave. It's when people announce retirements. Um, there's new schools opening. We know it's going to open, um, but they've now just finally posted, you know, on the boards. Um, you know, this wave, it's been a bit lighter this year. Um, some of these positions are even open for immediate hiring, the ones that are open for what it's worth, you know, but it's uh, but it's a little bit lighter this year. And I think it's because um because of the financial stress our school systems are under with, and we're not gonna go into all the politics of that, you know, everyone knows what it is, you know. Um I think that makes it hard where people are kind of hunkered down and getting in their tornado shelter. You know, it's like, well, I know the evil that I have here, and I know that I can have a good band right here, and I know what I know where I'm supposed to show up in the morning, and I'm getting paid a decent salary. I'm just gonna wait this thing out. So I think we're kind of hunkered down right now at after wave one. And then there's wave two, that's after UAL. Uh after UIL and before the end of school. We are in wave two. Okay. We're in wave two. People accepting new positions from wave one. So it's like musical chairs or uh, I don't know the best example, Tetris. You know, there's an empty spot, so someone's going to slide into that spot. Uh the people choosing to move on, possibly due to UIL scores, either good or bad. You know, some they might have a position somewhere and they see that this band director's done really well and they're headhunting. You know, they're they're looking at the boards and talking to people and going, hey, let's contact so-and-so. I think they would do a I think they would fit in our system.

SPEAKER_01 7:21

Or it can be almost like a free agency kind of thing.

SPEAKER_00 7:24

Oh, yeah, yeah. There's no doubt about that. In fact, I do that as kind of, you know, I don't make any money doing it, but I do that as a favor to uh admin of mine that I've had in the past that are looking for band directors. And I kind of headhunt for them or kind of clear the field for them, or I'll call someone and say, hey, you know, so-and-so's over here, and they're looking for a band director. And I know that man or that woman personally, and uh they're a good person. And uh they would like to talk to you. And so it is a little bit of headhunting going on. And sometimes, Derek, you know, you you pull those poor scores at UIL and you get called into the office, and they just kind of tell you, but I don't think this is working. So sometimes people are moving on because they did not do well in the past two years at any UIL contest or in it. Usually the the scoring at contest is not the rationale for whether you keep your job or not. But I found over time sometimes it's the final nail in the coffin.

SPEAKER_01 8:22

I can't really say it's something somebody can tangibly say, look, here's proof of what we've been saying.

SPEAKER_00 8:28

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:29

And it might be attitudes or might be the being culture.

SPEAKER_00 8:33

Yeah, the kids aren't behaving well, uh, doesn't handle the staff really well, doesn't work well within the school system. You know what I mean? And so, and that it's kind of hard to I I say that I'm not an administrator. I I suppose that's kind of like you said, it's not tangible. It's hard to to release someone from the responsibilities on the basis of I don't think people like what you're doing.

SPEAKER_01 8:56

You know, that that's I laugh, but that's a I've never thought of it in that light before.

SPEAKER_00 9:00

Yeah, yeah. So it's it's like that that's a that's kind of tough. You know, it's hard to argue emotions, you know, people's emotions, students' emotions, but it's not hard to argue, man, you just made a 554 in concert and a five five five in sight reading.

SPEAKER_01 9:14

And um, they gave up on you.

SPEAKER_00 9:16

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:17

I think the it'd be best for all involved if we kind of but I'm gonna say this too, real quick, before that that feels like almost like a negative light that we painted that in. Sometimes it's just not a fit. Nobody's mad, nobody doesn't like somebody. It just isn't working. Yeah. Yeah, there's no doubt.

SPEAKER_00 9:37

There's there's people whatever reason, or there's people who are in uh Five Ed MU, which is that honorary band fraternity sorority kind of thing, you know, and I'm uh happen to be a member of it. Um, but there's ones that I've uh put up for membership, and it's almost humorous because it'll be like uh state marching finalist, honor band finalists, straight sweepstakes, then one year at another school 334, 443. And you're right. So it's obviously a very talented individual, but whether it was the school's fault, the director's fault, a combination of everybody's fault, um, it just wasn't sometimes you're just not the right hand for that glove, you know, kind of moment. And uh sometimes we uh jump into jobs where it's uh, you know, was it uh on American Idol, dog, that song's too big for you.

SPEAKER_01 10:29

I don't know, dog.

SPEAKER_00 10:30

Yeah, I don't know, dog. That song, that's a big song. That song's a little too big for you, you know. And sometimes that happens. We've all we've all either actually faced that or we've had those feelings, you know, when you're in rehearsal going, ooh, I'm not sure what to do.

SPEAKER_01 10:45

But here's there's I mean, listen, I'm not gonna belabor this any more than I have to, but I've had friends in very ultra competitive areas that have come from a culture where the kids know the expectations and they work hard and they realize that's part of what made them uh very ultra competitive. They've moved to a place with the great aspiration of creating that culture again, but you move into a place where we we just don't work that hard here. And it's nobody's fault, they're just not used to it. They just we just don't work that hard here, and it can be very frustrating for everybody involved.

SPEAKER_00 11:18

Oh, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:20

And sometimes you say, I'm gonna make this thing work, and you've you last it out, and sometimes you're like, no, I'm going back where kids want to work. Yeah, and it's not the kids' fault necessarily, but you know what I mean, the cults.

SPEAKER_00 11:30

Yeah, and and honestly, as a sideline to that, I I have all the respect in the world for uh people who are that's what they want to do as a director, their life is certainly not as tumultuous, you know. But if the kids, their their thing is like, let's play uh uh Iron Man in the stands and let's have a good time and let's uh go to lots of trips and things, and and you know, contest is not gonna be a big important thing for us. I respect that. As long, but like you said, if if you don't have all that stuff laid out as far as the expectations of the school, the school board, the students, the parents, and the band director, if those things don't align, it's gonna be a long year, either direction, you know, on there. And then, you know, this end of school, I guess we're more maybe wave three-ish now, that 45-day mark, end of school till the 45-day mark, because by the time this uh podcast uh airs, we'll be closer to wave three. We'll still be in wave two, but we'll be closer to wave three. It's when you finally kind of lock the office door and you can kind of get away for a little bit. But there's that 45-day rule between uh the time that uh you can get out of a contract. You know, you can just tell them so I don't want to work here anymore. Here's my letter of resignation. If it gets tight in 45 days, is the 45 days before the first day of instruction of the school contract. Um, so and that's that's a big one. That's when, because that's when most jobs open up and there's more. I say in my notes, I put a lot to choose from. A lot of years it has been a lot to choose from. Um, I don't think there's near as many jobs to choose from. So be careful out there. You know, if you're gonna throw around ultimatums, you know, just be speak honestly and say the quiet part out loud. If you're gonna throw around ultimately ultimatums to your uh out loud to your administration about you're looking for a job and blah, blah, blah. And you know, I'm just I'm not satisfied here. Be careful. You'd better pretend like you're satisfied and just saying.

SPEAKER_01 13:29

There's the old saying, Mike, it's easier to find a job when you have a job.

SPEAKER_00 13:33

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:34

Yeah. So and I do think discretion is a loss to art.

SPEAKER_00 13:38

Oh yeah, yeah, no doubt about that.

SPEAKER_01 13:40

But you can put feelers out in a discreet way and not just I know that emotions are emotions, and we musicians, we're emotional folk.

SPEAKER_00 13:51

Yeah, our job is emotion.

SPEAKER_01 13:53

But we don't need to blow that emotion up and scream, I'm out of here, I'm quitting, find somebody else to do this. Maybe we should just keep that to ourselves and go find something better, and then say, Oh, by the way, I'm leaving.

SPEAKER_00 14:08

Yeah, and it can be you talked about being discreet. It can be as simple as uh just go to your administration and just say, Hey, um I'm looking uh to better my salary and I'm looking to better my circumstances as far as number of staff members or budget. Um, so I just want you guys and ladies to know that I am I am looking at different positions. That's a lot different than throwing your keys on the desk and going, I'm tired of all this crap and you guys don't support me. You know, so you're right. You know, uh call your best friend band director and vent on them, you know, little get all that out of your system, you know.

SPEAKER_01 14:46

Call Mike Lenny.

SPEAKER_00 14:48

Yeah, yeah. I always jokingly say, uh, people say, Do you clinic as a retired band director? Said, not really. I I provide uh emotional support and psychological counseling for band directors while I pretend to work with their bands, you know. And that's really but that's really what I do. And I think most of the people that I work with a lot would would agree with that. It's more of a uh they just need someone to, and it's not that I have any training in that whatsoever, but they just need someone they can vent to that they know it's a safe room, that I'm not gonna go and turn around and call that principal and go, hey, you realize your band directory.

SPEAKER_01 15:21

And somebody that's been there and felt that and knows exactly what you're I mean, you know, it's really nice to talk to somebody that goes, Yeah, I get it.

SPEAKER_00 15:28

Yeah, yeah. I get it when you you you really need an extra band director on staff for safety reasons, not even pedagogical reasons. But then the school just keeps saying, No, no, we can't do that. So then all of a sudden you've got one band director with 160 kids on a Friday night. You know, it's it's it's uh it's safety-wise, it's a dangerous thing. And educationally, it's not good. Well, you wouldn't give 160 kids to an English teacher, you know, to teach it once. You know, so it's and you wouldn't even give 160 athletes to a football coach to coach at once, would you?

SPEAKER_01 15:59

A single coach, right?

SPEAKER_00 16:00

Yeah, a single coach. You know, they're they they've there's a reason there's multiple coaches, you know, they all have their wheelhouse. Um, but you know, we're in that wave three, this big one will be coming up pretty soon. And that's when it's uh that's when it's hard to be discreet. You know, because it's like you see this whole the prairies open up to you, man. You've got all these jobs sitting there that you just know you're the right person for all these jobs. And uh it's easy to be kind of a little bit uh self-centered, and I speak from experience, a little bit self-centered about it. Said, oh man, they they would be lucky to have me. No, they're not gonna be lucky to have you. They're gonna find a band director. They a lot of admin don't even care if they have a good band. They just want a band that shuts up and behaves, you know, and play the fight song at first. Place fight song, school song, and national anthem, and uh doesn't cause any waves. And uh so be careful, be careful out there.

SPEAKER_01 16:54

You're gonna see all the seems to me though that wave three is is a wave three might be a fast moving, faster-paced wave because the jobs are open and people are trying to move before that 45-day rule hits.

SPEAKER_00 17:06

Yeah, and it is, and it's getting faster because as time progresses, I mean, there's a time when uh Texas band directors, TBA versus Texas folk, because I know there's people who listen to this that are outside of Texas, but our little convention used to be the very, very end of July. I mean the 28th. And now we're talking like the 17th of July. And I know people are thinking, 11 days? Is that a big deal? It kind of is.

SPEAKER_01 17:33

It's a big deal.

SPEAKER_00 17:34

It's a big deal. Plus, you lump on top of that, especially if you're a high school director and doing marching band, um, there's a lot of prep work that has to be done for marching band that did not exist 20 years ago. 20 years ago, you could just show up and hey, we're gonna play these three tunes. I'm gonna write the drill, and the color guard captain's gonna write the color guard work, and here we go. You know, and there's a lot more that goes into it now with uh bands with using custom arrangements or having it edited for your band. Uh, you know, we could that we've gone through that podcast already. And uh, but yeah, so it's a lot different. So, like you're saying, that little time frame is getting squeezed tighter and tighter, and schools are going later and later and starting earlier and earlier.

SPEAKER_01 18:16

We even feel that a lot on our side of it because used to be we'd we'd get stuff for summer at the end of May, and we'd have until roughly the first week of August to get we'd have a longer period, but they're going places later and later, they're taking trips into June. Oh, yeah, they'll they'll go to New York second week of July. So it's you know, it's almost like we've squeezed everything down to a one-month off season as opposed to a two to two and a half. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:47

And Derek, even you know, with our with our sponsored Harpley Music, it's hard because, you know, even band directors now are having their their beginner drives earlier and earlier. There's a time it was after the first six weeks of the school year that we'd all sit down with our beginners and the local music store would come through. And but now a lot of them are doing it in May, in April.

SPEAKER_01 19:08

Here's the spring drives are not uncommon anymore.

SPEAKER_00 19:11

Yeah. So it's a and I I I think that's that's great for the director to get things planned, but I could see where that's uh it's a nice opportunity for Tarpley music because it kind of spreads out a little bit, maybe the beginner drives, but it kind of makes things overlap. So I could see where that's a logistical challenge to to Tarpley Music to do that or any music store to do it. And the same way for bands, it used to be there's a very cut and dried difference between state solo and ensemble, and now we're we drop all that, we're done. Now it's time to think about marching band, and then we're through with marching band. Hey, it's time to think about solo and ensemble. Those days are gone. You know, it all overlaps. Yeah, it all bleeds together on that.

SPEAKER_01 19:51

So that's all the watercolor painting now, as opposed to defined lines.

SPEAKER_00 19:55

Oh, yeah, no doubt about it at all. And then wave four is the scariest wave, I think. It's the one where I find most of my friends who are first-year teachers, um, their their butts start to pucker really big time at wave four because they haven't gotten the job they want. They uh they they want to work in a certain part of the state, and that's no big deal. Sometimes they don't have a choice. They might have some parents that are aging that they need to be in that part of the state to help them out. But wave four is people are locked into their contracts, but there are still openings. That's like that, you know, mid-July until the start of the school year. And I want to throw out this for all those people that find themselves in that situation. Um, if you're a wave four hire, it's not always a bad job. I think proportionally, sometimes it is statistically. It's it's a harder situation because they would have failed earlier. Sometimes there's been situations where a director has passed away. Right. Or the best opportunity in the world just landed in that person's lap, and now they're gonna work. I'll tell you a true example, they're gonna work for a funeral home. And that way it's like, well, I'm I'm gonna go ahead and retire, I'm gonna stop, you know, and all of a sudden it's like, you know, July 25th, you know, and they're like, I'm I'm just I'm not gonna be here next year. Plus, I've known a lot of people who've gotten who've been hired in wave four that have stayed at that job for like 15, 20 years. You know, it just ended up being the perfect job. And not to be too philosophical or too religious in nature, but sometimes God knows what's we what we need, you know. Sometimes it's like you're looking at it going, oh man, I'm worthless. And uh I didn't get hired in wave one, I didn't get hired in wave two, I didn't get hired in wave three, wave four, I'm down at convention looking at that stinking bulletin board with all the notices on it and interviewing and drinking coffee and trying to get interviews at you know, eight in the morning uh at in San Antonio for us Texas folk. And uh you're thinking, man, this my life sucks. Don't do that. Your life might this might be the opening to the greatest thing that's ever happened in your life. And you said it earlier, Derek. Whatever job you get, you're not married to it. Right. You know, work a year, give it 100%, and then start looking for another job. Um, if it ends up being the best job you've ever had, then you're gonna go, oh my gosh, I can't believe this ended up being the perfect. I I've never even thought of living in this part of the state. But uh, my finances are better and uh my housing is better, and my insurance is better, and and the kids are better. And yeah, it might be a really good situation for you. So don't discount those wave four ones, especially those uh first-year teachers.

SPEAKER_01 22:43

Right. And I would say, just to piggyback that real quick, your mental perspective has a lot to do with how bad that job is. If you go into it thinking, oh, this is just gonna be like pulling teeth, it probably is. Yeah, but even if you think this is gonna be a job, what's that old saying? It's amazing how lucky you get when you work hard.

SPEAKER_02 23:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:08

That or the harder you work, the luckier you get. I guess that's the way it would go better. But I think that if you're an encourager, if you are approaching it with the right attitude, that that's kind of contagious. And even if your original assessment was correct, it doesn't mean it has to stay that way. Right. And if you go into it and and just plug away and make a people appreciate and recognize, by and large, appreciate that kind of enthusiasm, and then they start to see some results and the journey goes. I think that's a reality as much as I'm just gonna do my nine months and I'm out.

SPEAKER_00 23:47

Yeah. And sometimes the jobs that I guess we would categorize as not a good situation. Um, sometimes it is the fact that the community just doesn't want a band. They just yeah, it's you're right.

SPEAKER_01 23:58

It's arguing that, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:59

But but my point I want to make though is it's sometimes it's because the admin doesn't really know what they want. It's very surprising to me after I retired, because I was I was pretty lucky. Uh for the most part, I had admin that were very well schooled and what bands needed because I went after good band directors. Except my very first job, it wasn't that way. You know, I had an absolutely ignorant superintendent, my first job, had no idea, was taking money out of my budget, telling me I was overspending and didn't realize that I kept tracking my books, OCD, my cloney finances. And I went and said, I you need to tell me where I'm I've overspent that money. Finally, he broke down and goes, No, I took it and gave it to UIL Theater Arts, you know, because I took that money out of there. So sometimes there's some absolute idiots out there that are administrators that don't know what the hell they're doing. Um, but generally, nine out of 10 times, they just don't know. It's amazing how a soup will call me and uh one that I know from previous experience, and they'll go, hey, we're trying to hire a head band director, and here's what we're looking at. And I'll look at their what they're gonna post and I go, Well, no one's gonna apply for this job. Well, why? Well, because of this, this, and this. They go, Oh, that's important. Well, yeah, that that's important. Let me reword this for you and let's redo your scheduling. And uh, you know, uh, you know, there's it's interesting how it's it's not stupidity, like my first administrator was just stupid. Um, but you know, it's it's administrators who are ignorant, and I mean that with all love and respect. They just don't know. There's sometimes they're ex-coaches and they think a band program needs to be run like a football team. And in some cases, yes, there are things we do that we are band coaches, yes, but we're also art teachers. You know, we're also academic teachers. And so we have to have things set up logistically in a way that makes it where our kids can be successful. And so I say that to say, you know, sometimes you get into that way for job and you realize real quick that the principal wants the band to be better. They just don't know what to do to make the band better. And what we translate that into, Derek, is I hear it all the time. Oh man, my admin just gives me lip service on this. They they just say they want a band, but then they'll never well. Have you sat down with them and explained how we do our repair budget? Have you sat down with them and explained why we do sectionals? Have you sat down? Well, no, but they should know. No, they shouldn't. Just like you, you know, your trumpet player doesn't know the key of C sharp major. You know, it has to be presented to them, and then they have to understand what to do. So I say that with all love and respect, but kind of like our old thing about drum majors, if you want a good drum major, you're gonna have to train a good drum major. You know, if you want a good principal, you're gonna have to take time to explain how does contest work? How does the evaluations work? What are they listening for at contest? And it doesn't have to be this long extended thing. I just always love the fact that I could make an appointment because I never just barged in, but I'd say, hey, can I come in after contest and just talk to you for like 10 minutes? Sure. They thought that was exciting. So I'd come in to my critique sheets and I'd talk about the things we did that weren't correct and the things we did that were correct. And by the time you have that same administrator, maybe for uh two or three years, guess what? They're pretty well schooled. They can go judge a band contest.

SPEAKER_01 27:23

Right. They get it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:24

They get it, they understand what's happening.

SPEAKER_01 27:27

But you know, I again, I'm gonna go back to presentation really matters in some of that stuff. That it's one thing to tell everybody in the community, except that administrator, that you don't get any support and that they don't understand, and that you're just fighting an uphill battle. It's way different than going, as you just said, is saying, Can we sit down for a minute? Can I show you what I'm seeing? And there's some things that I think would make this better for the kids. Not better for me, better for the kids, better for this program. And I just kind of want to get your feedback on that. And even if you have to do that, as you said, it it takes a while to make a mind change or to to create a mind shift. But that's way better than you just don't get it. You hate me, you don't like our program. This guy's bad for our program. You know what I mean? There's such a difference in how you present things. Yeah. And I I'm gonna say, along with what you just said, that I don't know that some of those issues aren't just simple. I didn't know that from the administrator's side of it. Nobody's ever sat down with me and explained why they want things, they just demand things.

SPEAKER_00 28:46

Right. You're exactly right. And so and it's also the situation of uh, you know, with administration, they have such a high level of decision fatigue that you come in.

SPEAKER_01 29:00

That's a great point, Mike.

SPEAKER_00 29:01

Come in with your problem, but have like two or if possible, have two or three solutions. Man, my repair budget is terrible. Um, but I tell you what, here's what we can do. Um, if we could take a little bit of money out of our travel budget and we can take a little bit of money from here, then we can we can kind of limp through for this year and then maybe next year, let can we talk about the budget and maybe up like a couple thousand here, you know, or uh whatever the or you know, so if you want a jazz band and you've never had a jazz band at that school, that's gonna take some training with your admin because they don't know what a jazz band is usually, you know.

SPEAKER_01 29:40

Band is band is band, right?

SPEAKER_00 29:42

Yeah, it's uh and they don't understand why we need to buy this extra equipment and why there's gonna be a little more travel, but then present it as yeah, but this is like an amphibious assault band. You know, we can go we can go to the rotary club with one trailer and one bus, and I can drive the dang bus and I can take the kids for one hour and we can talk how incredible our school is with the town leaders, and we can play some fun music. It doesn't have to be Glenn Miller, it can be, you know, but it can be just, you know, there's lots of great charts that are just right off the radio right now. You know what I mean? You can stream the music and there's things written. So explain it to them in that aspect instead of I would like a jazz band because I think Clark Terry is an amazing soloist on Flugelhorn. No, no, that's our Miles Davis kind of blue is really a uh seminal album in jazz history, and we need to study it. No, no, no, those are the things you're gonna do once the admin okay's it. Okay. Right. Once they okay, then you can go do your band director stuff. But until then, it's like, hey, we're an amphibious assault band. We're gonna drop the door of the trailer, and these kids are gonna run off with their saxophones and we're gonna play some tunes for them, and they're gonna think we're incredible, and we're gonna we're gonna talk about how wonderful our admin is and how our school board is amazing. And guess what? Lions club meeting. Guess who's in that lions club meeting? Generally, all your admin, plus all the C. Your school board. Yeah, your school board. So they think you're just the most wonderful thing in the world. And they go, Oh, yeah, jazz, that's cool. So and then you counter it with, and I would like to go ahead and do the rehearsals for the jazz band, but I'm not gonna ask for an extra stipend. Maybe if this thing progresses to a really full-fledged program, we can have that discussion later. Have solutions instead of walking in and slamming down, we need this money now. If you want me to be band director, you got to give me more money on the table for budget.

SPEAKER_01 31:33

You know, and I I think if I'm guessing correctly, we're probably going to progress through some of these episodes into interviews. And some of that is probably great when you're actually sitting down with a new administrator and saying, these are the things I like. And as you say, you present them as a positive um reflection, community involvement of your what you'd like to see a band program do. But um jumping back into the the wave four of it, I think a big deal you said it very appropriately with don't it doesn't mean it's a bad thing. It's not a bad job necessarily. But I do think that there's something to be said for have faith in yourself. And I'm not, you know, whatever your belief system is, believe in yourself enough. And sometimes I know it's hard if you've been we've all had people that put us down so much that we started to believe it.

SPEAKER_02 32:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:33

At some point. But have faith in yourself. This is a passion of yours, it's something you love, and don't panic.

SPEAKER_02 32:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:41

That the right situation will probably show up if you're patient enough and you keep your eyes open and you don't just grab at the first thing because you want to grab at something.

SPEAKER_00 32:51

Yeah. And uh one more thing to say about the wave four is realize that at that moment, you're their savior. They're desperate for a band director in wave four. For whatever the reason is, they're desperate for someone to come in. So uh you can use that for your advantage to your advantage throughout the year. And not that you said, Oh, no one else wanted this job, but you you can go, uh, hey, you know, I came in here not knowing exactly what I was getting into because it was so late in the year. These are the things I've noticed now. Can we can we work on these? So realize that that uh, you know, as you're interviewing, the table, the cards are kind of stacked in your favor because they are joining someone to come in and do this job. So, you know, the what I call the honeymoon period of that first year in the new gig, you know, that honeymoon period where they'll they'll likely grant some more budget money and things of that nature before you they take you for granted, you know what I mean? Um, is a little bit longer if you're a way four band director.

SPEAKER_01 33:52

Hey, could we have a transparent conversation real quick? We're both pretty transparent guys. I I don't know that it works this way anymore, but there was a time, I think, when the retirement structure was set up based on X number of your best paying years, right?

SPEAKER_00 34:09

Still is.

SPEAKER_01 34:11

So do you find that sometimes people go, you know what, I know this is going to be painful, but I'm gonna go do this for three to five years just to make sure that my retirement loads. I'm not sure that's the best way to go looking for a job, but is that still a real factor in any of these waves?

SPEAKER_00 34:27

I think it's possibly a factor. I I think it's a factor in these waves because it's mainly band directors who are getting out of band directing and you have middle management uh master's certifications, and they're becoming principals or fine arts coordinators, because that's where the that's where the the money jump happens. There's not going to be a huge, I mean, there's not gonna be a life, in my opinion, very rarely is there a life-changing amount of money switching from one band director job to another.

SPEAKER_01 34:56

But you know, we've talked about this and for our friends across the nation, Texas is such a big place that there's a a pretty big cultural shift between the way we teach bands in different parts of the state. I mean, teaching band is teaching band. But we've talked about this before for a young person out in the deserts of West Texas, they typically have to pay a little more to attract people to come work there. Or at least it used to be that way. I don't know that it still is.

SPEAKER_02 35:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:26

And so you've talked about before. Do three years at this, save your money, and then move into the really high uh populous metropolitan areas. There is, is there something to be said for that in these waves, is what I'm saying. As you're thinking.

SPEAKER_00 35:43

There is. And uh and it's funny too, because you you mentioned that, and so there are people who do it that way. You know, it's like, hey, I'm gonna go over here to work for three years, and guess what? 15 years later, they're still out there.

SPEAKER_01 35:54

They're still there, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 35:54

Isn't that funny? They they realize that hey, these kids are really awesome, and these people are really awesome, and this pay is really awesome. You know, there's gigs out there, and that it's uh I've never had one like this, but there's gigs out there, they do matching 401ks, there's no copay on your insurance. Um, they provide school housing for X amount of dollars per month, you know, and they're nice little homes, you know. So it's good situations out there, and uh, they they have the uh energy money to uh to fund their programs really well. And so they don't mind doing that. And but it is funny you say that because I've known directors who've done that. I'm just gonna go out there and work three years. Also, 15 years later, they're still out there. You know, you go, Hey, I thought you were gonna do three years. And yeah, but it I really like it out here. I don't I don't want to move anywhere else, you know. So uh be careful if you do it for that reason because you might get trapped out there.

SPEAKER_01 36:46

Right. But I can also say it from the standpoint of looking at the different waves, and we start out real high energy that everybody I think the younger we are, no offense to any of our young friends, but the younger we are, the more certain we are that somebody is just waiting for us to come be the next greatest band director that anybody's ever seen. And you know, as life happens, we realize I don't this sounds negative, but it's not. We realize our limitations, we realize who we are, we realize where our strengths are, we realize where we fit best or what our best attributes are. And sometimes I almost think it's smart to stop and go, how do I, my personality, my strengths, and my weaknesses fit that opening? I know it looks like a cool job, but will I actually enjoy you know what I mean? Some realistic instead of just chasing money. I think that happiness.

SPEAKER_00 37:44

If you're ever chasing money as a band director, you've screwed up already.

SPEAKER_01 37:49

I think a good fits is important and probably worth a little bit of money.

SPEAKER_00 37:53

So yeah, I mean a manager at Academy Sports makes about$20,000 more than an average band director. So if you're chasing money, get out of band directing. You know what I mean? There's a little bit to be said about getting a little bit better pay or whatever, but if that job, you're in trouble. You're in trouble on that. You're not you're not going to become a wealthy person unless you invest money really well. And going back to young people, though, one thing to kind of throw in here, because we need to talk about, you know, job searches. We've gone through the waves and probably maybe spent too much time on those because I the next part is actually more important than just the logistical waves. One thing is a quick reminder about your social media presence. And this, I don't care if you're 20 or you're 65, because I know people who are in the 60s and 70s are just uh have the same mindset. You are free to place anything on social media that you desire. Just understand those of us who hire, and I've been on that side for a long time, are going to search your pages or have someone search your pages and review whatever public information is out there. If you're already hired somewhere, you still have the right to free speech in terms of what you post, just as you've always had. You're an American. You're free to post anything you wish. Just understand, as soon as that content interrupts the educational environment and the students in the classroom or pisses off an administrator, you may also have the freedom from unemployment.

unknown 39:17

Right.

SPEAKER_00 39:17

You know, you have the freedom to be fired. In addition to your freedom of speech, we are living in strange times of great division right now. So I'm just saying, be careful out there, guys. Let me continue with this. Be careful out there because, you know, I see so many posts of, you know, hey, we got wasted Friday night in Austin, and we just barely got up in the morning, and now we're gonna get on planes and go to Cozumel and we're gonna just spend a week drinking. I have no problem with you doing that. In my younger days, I did that, okay? But I did not have the luxury of social media at the time, and thank God. Because the permanence. Yeah, or the permanence, because it's there forever. It's there forever. You think you deleted it, and uh it's not totally deleted. Um, so I just want to just be smart. And you were gonna say something, Derek. I just wanted to finish my thought.

SPEAKER_01 40:06

No, I'm just gonna say we've seen examples, even it's great to have political beliefs. But we've seen examples recently of people losing their jobs over a little bit too vitraulic of a post about how they believe or something about the other side. I mean, we've we've seen people lose their jobs over things that they've commented on socially.

SPEAKER_00 40:34

And and even more so, it makes it very, very easy to not hire.

SPEAKER_01 40:41

Right.

SPEAKER_00 40:41

I mean, I agree with that. It's pretty it's it's a it's more selective of someone losing their position. But I tell you what, it's uh you can filter through those 75 applicants or whatever pretty pretty dang quick when you look at their social media pages and go, I do not want this person, not because of political beliefs, just in general. You know, everything they think and do is thrown out on a social media page, and I don't know when that hand grenades, it's like walking around with a hand grenade in their hand the whole day. You don't know when that thing's gonna blow up.

SPEAKER_01 41:10

So uh but the other part is you will never you don't even have to know it. They won't tell you that. They don't have to tell you why they're not really interested.

SPEAKER_00 41:19

Correct. And that's the funny part about it is the uh people who are really used to doing that on social media for not just political, but just anything, they really think that it that they were not hired for some other reason.

SPEAKER_01 41:34

Right. They never stop to consider. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:37

Be smart. Try to be smart, keep a little bit to yourself, you know. Yeah. Everything you do and say and think does not have to be put on social media. In fact, um, for me personally, I don't do a lot of political things or even social commentary on social media because I think it's pointless because you're not gonna convince anyone to change to what you're thinking. So, why are you risking everything you have in a fool's errand of trying to fight for the cause? Right. So I'll just leave it at that. Let's leave it at that. Okay. Um, now in uh this application process, there's gonna be a lot of people applying for the same job generally. Um, so the situation with you versus literally hundreds of other applicants, depending on the job you're looking at. If you're looking at a very high-profile job and you're a head band director and you're a high school band director or a middle school band director applying at a gig that's the triple C honor band, you know, um, you there's some things you've got to do, some considerations for that. How do you stand out? What can you do to stand out? Here's some considerations for it. There's no perfect recipe for landing a job, but here's kind of Mike Bloney's list of some things one might consider when you're trying to get your foot in the door. One is number one is this, and it's this I I smile because it's I've seen it so poorly done the other way. Proofread and have others proofread your materials, including your resume, your cover letter, and other communication. I have been sent materials with someone else's school and name on them a very large number of times. This should not happen. You know, the cover letter says, I'm looking for a job in Alvaredo's school system as a middle school band director. Well, you just sent it to me. I'm at Abilene Wiley. I'm uh two hours to the west, you know, and you did not take time to proofread. Now, granted, we all make mistakes, correct? But uh maybe let someone else read it. Um, you know, don't send it out right away, let it sit on your computer for the day, for the evening, and the next day when you're a little fresher, get a cup of coffee and read it again and and you know, and and find that, you know. Um the other thing is number two, it's risky to use the same cover letter for every job. Because I've had I I've seen this happen. I mean, it's just obvious. It's like how we can spot AI, you know, now. And uh I would say that too. This is my latest entry in this job search thing. Please don't use AI to write your cover letter. It's so dang obvious. Because nobody talks that way. No one talks that way except a computer that has access to the entire internet. You know, so just write your letter, even with maybe a little bit of poor grammar. The proofreading thing is not necessarily the grammar. I think things need to be spelled right. I'm a terrible speller, by the way. But um, but you know, if it's not really presented in a very uh flowing uh lyrical way of getting this information, that's okay. Just let it be yourself. Okay. But don't use the same cover letter for each job. Consider composing a new one because every job's different. One letter does not fit all. This also reduces the chances of you making a copy paste error and sending the correct materials to the wrong potential employers discussed above. You know, also be humble and conservatively confident in your wording. Be humble. You what you want to do is say, this is what I can do to help your band, instead of I am the best thing you've ever seen as a band director. Right. It's the same thought, but presented in a different way. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 45:24

It also shows the persp the person reading it that you've actually considered, assessed, and thought about what you could do to help their program as opposed to I could fix any program.

SPEAKER_00 45:35

Yeah. Yeah, I'm just I'm just the craftsman crescent wrench, and I can I can fix everything that's given to me. Um that's a dangerous uh role to take on. Okay, and going into what you just said, uh, research each program you apply to. The potential employer employer can tell instantly if you envision yourself being a part of the team or you just need a job. There's nothing wrong with just needing a job. We've all been there. Okay, just don't portray yourself that way. Okay. Put more effort into your search. You can figure out the uh logistics of the scoring on the standardized test, the uh local, you know, the per capita income level of the people at the school, the the tax base per capita income level for that particular school, um, what things they've been successful in. Are they in the Lone Star Cup running year after year? You might mention that because administrators to them, that's like our honor band kind of thing. They they they they really get into that. You know, say, hey, I saw you were fourth place in a Lone Star Cup last year, man. That's hey, I think it, you know, do you realize a band actually adds points to that? Right. So there's some things I envision for this program that I think we can maybe add a few points here and there, and I can actually be productive in and making you look stronger as an administrator because we can work together on this, you know. So just make sure do your research, you know. Uh if you won't put in the effort there, how do they know if you'll put any effort in in your job? If they just feel like you interview three for the day, you know.

SPEAKER_01 47:12

I feel like the assumption is you won't.

SPEAKER_00 47:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:15

They're not gonna wonder. They're gonna say, well, he didn't care enough to do that. He's not gonna why would I expect him to put effort in the job?

SPEAKER_00 47:22

Yeah. Or something as simple as uh uh figure out how to say the name of the school or the town.

SPEAKER_01 47:32

I get that.

SPEAKER_00 47:32

If you go to Mahaya, don't go and say, I want to be the head of the city.

SPEAKER_01 47:35

That's exactly what you're just thinking of gonna be a Mexia.

SPEAKER_00 47:38

You know, it's like where? Mexia. Okay, never mind.

SPEAKER_01 47:42

Here's a fun here's a fun one too. I got corrected, good friend, Mr. Sedery. I love you. But I was doing well, it was an area. I think you were doing tabulations and I was doing announcing, and I said Colorado City.

SPEAKER_00 47:54

Yeah, it's Colorado City. And he said Colorado High School from Colorado City. It's not Colorado. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:02

I'm like, what are you what are you talking about? I've said Colorado my whole life. Yeah, but that's wrong.

SPEAKER_00 48:08

Yes. Or I'll judge a contest and it'll be uh, let's say a college band director is one of the panelists on there as an evaluator, and they might be from like Tennessee. And so they'll ask me, they're really smart because they'll go, Hey, how do you pronounce this name? And I'll tell them, I go, You're messing with me, aren't you? So no, no, I'm not messing with you. That's really how they pronounce it, you know.

SPEAKER_01 48:33

Not even just the city, but maybe figure out because there are some names out there. If you're going to be interviewing with people, look at it. Because our good friend Hekomovich, you know how many times I had to say that before I was confident to say it over a microphone?

SPEAKER_00 48:48

Yeah. And uh I had no idea about that until I think you told me because I I knew Brian, I've known him forever since uh he was a McMurray here in Abilene, and I always thought it was Hekamovich, Hekomovich, you know, and John Landine instead of John Landon. You know, there's there's you know, figure out how the how to pronounce them on there. Uh something like uh uh one of the judges where the evaluators are going, okay, that's Pecos. No, it's Pecos. So no, it's Pecos. I promise you it's Pecos. Yeah. If you go in and say Pecos, if you go to the truck stop and say, Are we in Pecos, Texas? They're gonna go, why don't you just leave, sir?

unknown 49:24

Right.

SPEAKER_00 49:25

Any of those Pecos cantaloupe? Get on down the road. Yeah. So it's a you know, those little tiny things, believe it or not, they're little and small, but they're kind of big things, aren't they, Derek? You know, it shows in enough time to talk to somebody on that. Okay. Um, you know, it might not be a good idea to be pushy asking or for inviting yourself to interview. You know, in other words, if you've given your resume and you've given your cover letter, um, I think it's perfectly appropriate to call and or to email would be better because calling is like considered rude nowadays, you know, but I I don't understand that, but it is. Um, but you know, to give communication, say, have you received my materials? Is there anything else you need? Yeah, is there anything else you need from me and to further this process? And just leave it at that. Because if you call back every three days saying, have you have done interviews yet? Have you picked out the ones you're gonna interview? Have you, you know, what you're doing is pushing yourself away from that job. I promise you that. And I mean, it I can't see it in going any other way. So please don't take that personally because I know that you you're excited, you want to do it. Um, and also if you don't get an interview, you either didn't fit the needs or there's something wonky in your written communication. Um don't take it personally. Just keep correcting what you're doing. And sometimes it has the fact that they wanted a clarinet player and you play trombone. You know, they were that specific in what they're looking for. And it's just not your let's say you've been a middle school director your entire life and have uh never taught marching band, because that happens in Texas. Um, then all of a sudden you want to be a head director and do marching band, they might not interview you because of that. So it might be a good idea to talk with your local high school band director, you know, and the one you work with daily and say, can I come to summer band? And will you, if I if I do a good job, would you write a letter for me saying I've had input and what happens, you know, just keep working to make yourself more uh uh appeal-wise to the to the interview person, okay? Just make sure that they they know that you're trying to be better and better and better, okay? And then the fifth one, network. And it used to be even more important than it is nowadays. It really was. Because you remember the let me talk about dating myself, the old days when you called the the road rep from different music stores in different cities, and you said, Hey, uh, well, what's open? Because schools, besides the region service center, there was no job boards. There was no internet, you know. So, so we just had to rely on, you know, you know, so and so I know them and Amarillo, or I know this person in Victoria, Texas, and they told me there's a job opening down here, so I'm gonna go down there. Because I I've seen this happen um in terms of networking. I've seen this posted before about um on social media, of all things, people saying such and such school district hired someone from inside and never posted the job. Did you know they have to post the job?

SPEAKER_01 52:38

It's a legal thing, right?

SPEAKER_00 52:39

And did you know that it does not have to be on social media? It does not have to be on a job board. It can be on a typed piece of paper taped to the front door of the superintendent's office. It can be on the bulletin board in the high school. They could post it. It that's where the disconnect happens between young and old. They think just because it wasn't on the TMEA job search board or the ATSSB job search board, that something illegal has happened. No, they all they have to do is write they can hand write it on a sheet of paper, looking for high school band director at such and such school district and tape it to the front door and leave it there for three days. After three days, pull it off the door and throw it in the trash and then hire that person inside the school district. So I say that because network with people that can speak to your character, they can speak to your integrity, they can speak to your work ethic and your teaching. Notice the order I put those in.

SPEAKER_01 53:36

Right.

SPEAKER_00 53:37

Your integrity, your character, your integrity, your work ethic, and then finally teaching, because if the first three are correct, your teaching will eventually become better and better and better. Those are your references.

SPEAKER_01 53:52

I'm saying this all the time. If if you do your job right, with the right attitude and work hard at it, it's amazing how easy finding the next job. Maybe that's not the right way to say that. I've I've had people that say, you know, I and I'm one of those people, I really haven't had many job interviews in my life that were beyond, hey, we're interested in you, are you interested in us? And I realize there's more to talk about. But because of the job that people do, that speaks volumes. It doesn't matter what you say, it's what you've done, it's your reputation. Maybe that's not fair, and maybe that's not where you're headed there, but I'm telling you that here's a truth. Let's talk about the coaching trees of famous coaches. And you'll hear them say, Oh man, somebody just hired your offensive coordinator. That's terrible. He goes, That's actually a compliment. That successful programs, they're gonna poach your rising young stars out of your system, and then you grow another one. Um so I don't know if that fits in line with what you're talking about or not, but if you're doing a great job where you are right now, that probably matters more than your resume.

SPEAKER_00 55:09

Yes. And also, you know, this sounds kind of odd to say it this way, but ask your references references for their permission to use them on your materials.

SPEAKER_01 55:21

Please ask permission.

SPEAKER_00 55:22

And uh ask them if this is this is a blunt conversation, but it's okay to ask them. Said on a scale of one to ten, what would with 10 being the best possible reference, where would you place me on this given job? Because I know when people ask me that question, I'll I'll tell them, I'll say, man, it's easily a 10 or you know, probably about a five, because you've got a lot of weaknesses that you've got to work on that don't fit exactly with what this job is. And so it's not you or the job, it's just the two just don't go together very well. That's better to know beforehand because then you can leave me off your reference list. Right. You know, so the because nowadays it's it's the first thing comes a email blows onto your computer and has all the generic, you know, looks like an AI thing or something, you know, scale of one to five on all these things. It's like it's absolutely pointless and ridiculous, by the way. You know, I would just as soon have a text. Is this person going to be good for this job? And I would rather just send a letter in. But it is what it is. It's a legal issue, I'm sure. They they they want to keep things. But you know, most automated systems these days require some level of initial reference. If you get blown up there, there's not a chance for an interview. If someone ranks you one to five and they put ones and twos in all the categories because they don't think you fit, you'll never get an interview. I don't think. Right. You know, so and you didn't know that. You kind of got blindsided by it, and you never will know it unless you ask. Think about that.

SPEAKER_01 56:56

I think that's the most valid point of that. You may never know it.

SPEAKER_00 56:59

Yeah, you just don't know what's happening on there. Okay. Um, on new graduates, have more experience than just student teaching on your resume, if possible. You know, try to teach some lessons, teach some summer band camps, volunteer time, gain experience. Show us you are the kind of employee that was willing to go above and beyond, even as a college student, who we all know already plays in a ton of ensembles. So it's okay to say you're the principal flautist of the wind ensemble. Um, I think that's awesome. You know, it shows that you've worked hard. And so put that stuff in there. That's important, but also put in the other stuff, even if it's a job working at some other, you know, a grocery store or Pizza Hut or something. You know what I mean? Throw that in there, especially as new graduates. As time goes by, start leaving that stuff off, you know, because then it's all about what was your last job as a band director. But going into it, I want to have a, you know, were you a counselor at a at a Baptist campground for the summer for four summers? To me, that's important because it shows that you can manage kids.

unknown 58:02

Right.

SPEAKER_00 58:02

They hired you back for three other summers, didn't they? You know, so those little tiny things end up being really big things when I've got like a stack of applicants, you know, and it's like, hey, this this one shows some promise. You know, they're they're a new graduate, and well, we need someone fresh and new in this position. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 58:22

All right. And I think that sort of what I'm hearing, correct me if I'm wrong, is show things that are list things that show your character and show your um intrinsic abilities as opposed to I can count to four and wave my hands at the same time.

SPEAKER_00 58:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 58:39

I mean, that's kind of the expectation of the job, right? That you can conduct. Yeah. But what makes you different from anybody else that can conduct?

SPEAKER_00 58:47

Yeah. And also for new graduates, realize that you are a special commodity because uh the logistical side of it is sometimes the admin is more uh in line of let's hire a first, second, third year teacher because it won't cost us as much money. I mean, that's why part out loud. Okay. I think maybe in some ways that might be ageism or illegal. I have no earthly idea. I haven't talked to an attorney about this. But you know, sometimes it's, but they also have the freshest, newest ideas. You know, they they've they've seen things through different eyes that they can kind of help out your staff. And they're in a lot of ways, they're kind of a clean slate. You can go and you can incorporate them into your system of what you want to do. So I want to say that as an encouragement to all those new graduates out there that uh don't think that you're you're the last choice. Okay. You're not the last choice. Okay. You might be the first choice when it comes time for because they'll see everything that you can do. And another one is this this is funny to say, make sure you're getting into this profession because you actually like kids. If you're teaching music just because you love music, you're gonna struggle. You got to love kids and then love music. Let that come across in your initial communication. And we we would joke about it all the time. So you know, just you know, I think all directors have said things like, Man, this is a great job till the kids show up.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:12

You know, I'd love this job if it wasn't for the kids. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:15

If it wasn't for the kids, man, this would be a great gig, you know. So we joke about it, but you've acted you've got to like being around kids. Or, you know, you really need to find something different to do with your time because you're you're not gonna be uh you're not gonna be good at what you do. You know, you're not gonna be a good teacher if you don't like being around kids and kids being a good idea.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:34

You don't like kids to figure out your buttons if you have certain buttons that just send you over the edge. Oh, yeah. Those kids will find those and poke poop.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:44

They will, they will. Um most employers never enjoy fielding calls about where they are in the interview process. Trust me.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:53

I would agree with that.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:54

Employers will call you if your skill set fits, skill set fits their needs. Think about it. It's in their best interest to get the most qualified applicant for their program's needs. How does it serve the employer to ignore you when you are what they need? Further, how does it serve the employer to interview you when they aren't actually interested in hiring you? Why would they be wasting their time granting you an interview if they weren't truly interested in you working at their school? You can keep checking on the timeline if you want, but that's going to get old really quick. And I really think it kind of pushes you away from that job. You know, that's just that's that's my opinion. I don't have any factual basis for that, except in my own life when I was hiring an assistant band director because we had a decent band staff of numbers and quality as well. Um, but you know, that made me think less and less because this person is rather irritating. You know, every day there's a phone call or a text message, or hey, where are we at on that? Anything else you need from me? Oh Lord, this is what I need in my life. Someone to send me 41 texts a day, you know, because they're they just need affirmation on whether they're a good person or not. You know, um, that's not who I want to hire. That's just me personally. Another person might like that attention. I don't know. Maybe I'm totally off base. And they like that idea that someone's just checking the whole time because this person hiring is the most important person in the world, and that narcissistic attitude on the hiring side kicks in. I don't know. I don't have any data for that. I just tell them from my own experience. Okay. And then one of the very first mistakes new teachers make in choosing a place to apply is making one of the following statements. I only want to teach in parentheses, insert high demand area here. I won't consider a small school, or I'm not willing to move. Here's the secret: there's actually great kids everywhere. Many of them are waiting for someone who's dedicated and driven to help them realize their potential. Be open to other areas. If you want to increase your likelihood of landing a job, you are in this for the kids, remember, not the geographic location. And I hate to say that out loud because I've spent my whole career in probably about a two-hour radius. You know what I mean? It's in Texas, that's nothing. That's neighbors. You know what I mean? Wichita Falls and Abilene. That's it. Right. That's all my jobs have been in those two little tiny areas. But my very first job was in the little town of Throckmorton, Texas. Okay. And uh coming out as an Air Force brat and uh, you know, went to I will park with a really great band director and a really uh fairly big program, you know, two concert bands, all that kind of stuff, to go with uh, you know, 25 kids in a 1A school in Throckmorton, where it's the only high school in the entire county. Um, it would have been real easy to go, nah, it's uh it's it's I I really I want to teach like in a city, you know. But that was besides the ad besides the superintendent, who was an absolute idiot um at that time. Um, besides him, it was the best thing that ever happened to me, you know. I just had to avoid the superintendent at all costs because it was a really a good gig for me. And there's still people to this day that I I'm so grateful they were in my life at that time. Okay. So be careful with that. It's okay to want to teach in San Antonio if you're a San Antonio person. It's okay. Um, but don't limit it to that, that you're just not going to accept an interview outside of the city or side of the burbs. Okay. And again, you know, make sure your social media presence is appropriate for public consumption. You know, yes, it is yours, and you're free to say and do what you want to, just like we as employers are free to see it and become concerned and take a hard pass on your employment here. Though that's that's kind of I did that twice because I think it really is that important. Okay. Um I this is my preference. I know some people don't agree with this, but I like for applicants to try to make their uh their uh cover letter one page as much as possible their resume to be one page, you know, hit the important stuff. Um, don't drone on for a six, seven page resume because um that just finds its way to my garbage pile. Okay. That's just me. Some other people might like that. Again, that's just my opinion. Um, send all of this in PDF, not word format or some kind of word processor format. Make it a PDF because word files can turn in some pretty strange layouts and it's very confusing to read. Um, you know, again, make it concise. Triple check your spelling, make sure the cover letter is correct, you know, for that school. We already talked about that. Um, and again, don't send a six page resume unless, you know, you've had bands at Midwest and you've uh you've started four programs and you're you've written six books and you're on the tour. Yeah, I mean, we're on the ridiculous. Side. You know, if you had a babysitting job once or you're the kindergarten line leader and when you were age five, don't put that on your resume. Okay. It doesn't really apply to the current situation. It was exciting at the time, okay, that I was line leader and in as a kindergartner and I got to lead the class to lunch. Um, but you know, I'm being sarcastic, but you know what I'm saying. You know, it's like I I made a I made a uh one on my trumpet solo my freshman year in high school. Who gives a rip? What did you do in college? What have you done in your last job? We don't care if you it's okay to say I went to this high school and so-and-so was my band director, and feel free to call them. Okay. And this is a big one. Answer your dad gum phone. Check your voicemails, check your emails. It may be an interview opportunity. I don't know how many times I would send out information in the summer, say, hey, I want to interview you, and I wouldn't hear back from them for two and a half weeks. By that time, we've already hired somebody. Oh, yeah, I just got your message. And also this be available to interview. If I have to go to the fifth or sixth option for your availability, it makes me think you don't really want the job. And I know there's circumstances, there's surgeries, there's family things that happen. But you know what? That gets old pretty quick. It's like, hey, Derek, I want to interview you for this assistant band director job. Can you come in Tuesday? No, I can't do Tuesday. I've got a I've got a dentist appointment that morning. Okay, uh, what about Wednesday? Oh, I can't do Wednesday. The bug guy's coming to spray the house, and then I've got to mow my yard. You know, I mean, it gets almost ridiculous. I'm I'm giving you real examples. Those are real examples of people have told me things like that. If I get down to the fifth or sixth option, I'm kind of like, I wish I wasn't even having this conversation now. Uh, you know, I'm thinking in my mind, I don't want this person because every time I need them to do something, they're gonna be the same way. It's gonna be, oh, well, I can't do that right now. I've got this going on, I've got beginner drive coming up, so I can't help with the banquet. I can't do this, you know. So it's a mindset. So, and I'm not saying drop your whole life, but if you really want that job, you'll drop some things. You know, you'll figure it out. You'll figure out a way, at least the first, second, or third option. Okay. Right. And just final random thoughts. It's easy to get discouraged in this process, both as an applicant and as someone looking for it to hire someone. You got to trust this process, get reaching out to network opportunities like past teachers, past colleagues, some you know with with any connections. You don't even know if there's a connection. When I was hired at holiday, um, excuse me, I was hired at Wiley. The assistant superintendent was Don Harrison, who happened to have roomed with Coach Will Clapp at holiday in college. And his son lived behind. This is a long story, sorry. His son lived behind me in Iowa Park, which was 10 miles from holiday. So I gave Will uh a ride to holiday every morning because his dad had to be there really super early as a coach, and then his dad would bring him home. Isn't that interesting? I wonder how much impact that had. Where Don Harrison said, Oh yeah, I just talked to Will, uh Will Clapp's dad, and uh, you know, who I roomed with in college, and we played football together. And he said, Yeah, Mike's a great guy, and he helps out by taking his son to school every morning because band was first period. And uh, I just find that really interesting that it was just a neighbor and an Iowa Park connection, because Don Harrison played in the state championship Iowa Park football team, and I was from Iowa Park. They played football together in college at ACU at Abilene Christian University. I had no idea. I was just showing up for an interview, and all of a sudden, you know, we talked about that for about 20 minutes about the Iowa Park 1969 state championship, and we talked about ACU, and we talked, we talked about all this stuff, and we talked about Will. We talked about his dad. Uh, and then we, oh, yeah, yeah, you're here for a band director job. Let's talk about that a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:01

Let's get down to it, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:03

Yeah, let's let's get down to the job gig. So don't, you know, be ready for anything to happen. And you know, the networking can be the strangest thing. It can be a deacon at your church that just happens to know someone that owns an insurance company in Victoria, Texas.

unknown 1:10:17

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:18

It's amazing to me how small the world is.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:21

And it shows up at the most interesting times.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:24

Yeah. So that that's my podcast on hopefully to help some people out on their job hunting stuff, because you know, a job's a big part of our life, Derek. You know, it provides the social security, the financial security. And uh, I think it's more so, this sounds misogynistic, but maybe more so with guys. If you ask most people, you know, you want to get to know them, what's usually one of the very first questions? What do you do for you? What do you do? And it's part of our identity. So job hunting is super, super important, you know, but do it in the right order. So those are just some ideas, some ideas to help hopefully get you through that process.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:08

I think it's awesome. And as a person who hires people, it's great for me to listen to that again and go, you know what? Yeah, I I can agree with what you just said about some of the pitfalls and or some of the things that make me go, I really want to talk to that person.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:25

Again, I would say believe in yourself, have faith in who you are, and don't be closed-minded about opportunities.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:34

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:35

So all right, brother. Well, I assume that you'll probably this this is an assumption of mine, but it I I guess you're not going to turn away anybody that calls and says, Hey, we're looking for a person, or hey, I'm looking for something. Uh do you know of anybody or any openings? But uh not trying to open you up to that, I guess, too hard, but don't uh that's it. I guess the other point I'm trying to make is don't be scared to ask people, what do you know about this, or what do you know about them?

SPEAKER_00 1:12:05

Yeah. Or the best question, would that job be good for me?

SPEAKER_01 1:12:09

That's the one I'm trying to get to. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:11

Would I think that job be good for me? I know it looks like a bird's nest on the ground, it's a golden opportunity. Would that job be good for me? Not really. Or yeah, that job was built for you, you know. So it's good to get that opinion. It's not law, but it's opinion.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:26

Sure. Awesome. Well, I hope you have a great week, my friend.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:29

I will. I have no choice.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:34

We'll talk soon.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:35

All right, see you later, Derek.